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Finished: 07 PM Sun 28 Apr 19 UTC
Private ODC 2019 - R1 G14
1 day, 12 hours /phase
Pot: 35 D - Autumn, 1910, Finished
Classic, Anonymous players, Sum-of-Squares Scoring, Hidden draw votes, Wait for orders
1 excused missed turn
Game won by chluke (7741 D (G))
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Hi people,
Notice that Russia has 10 SCs and easily 13. No enemies on his back and very few in front.
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Hi people,

Notice how E/F have been attacking Germany since the start of the game and how E/F would have marched thru and eliminated Germany without Russia's help.

People, notice also how Italy would have been eliminated without Russia pressuring Austria from the other side.

People, notice how France would like an outcome without Germany or Italy included in the end.

"People" (er uh, "France"), notice how you could, instead of sounding fake concern while going for your own personal interest of YOUR ideal 3way draw, you could allow Germany to have Bel and the English centers so Germany would have the units not to worry about a late stab from Russia to end this in a 3 way draw that instead suits France because it does not include Germany.

"People" (i.e. "France"), notice how if you gave Italy centers on your side of the stalemate line (Por/Spa/Mar), instead of pretending to be everyone's world savior so you can instead simply eliminate Italy for YOUR own ideal 3way draw without Italy, then Italy would have an endgame position where you and Austria cannot just wipe Italy off the map.

People, notice all the enemies on France's back, and how France would grow if you allow your centers to be exploited by France so that France can get a 3way draw without you.

People, thanks for noticing the whole reality of what's happened in this game, instead of just noticing France's fake reality where France gets a 3way endgame that excludes Germany and Italy (and even England for that matter, but who's counting).
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Since the game started:
1. agree with Italy some DMZ and Peace and we both have respected it.
2. I'm defending Bur, neve enter German territory.
3. I had opportunities to Stab England and never did it.
So, Russia, don't be so proud.
The reality is measured in SCs owned, and you win.
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Oh, my bad, France. I guess you never went for Hol or Ruh, and England never went for Den. And I'm sure you and Austria would have let Italy keep one last center at Tunis after Rom/Nap were lost, just to be nice guys.

In all seriousness though, everyone knows that with you in one corner, France, and me in the other, that only one of E/G will survive and only one of I/A will survive. I'm NOT abandoning Germany or Italy (unless you somehow persuade them to abandon me first). So, France, if you want a draw that includes you, then let Germany into England's centers and give Bel to Germany (Bel is not a crucial center for France), and let me and Italy finish off Austria.
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Only facts Russia. Not guess or threats or what would be. 10 SCs.right now
Plus:
This is a game with SOS, so doesn't matter if a 3 way draw or 5 way draw. If you have more SCs you win.
People (that's, rest of the players) : look at the points we all have right now.
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Looking forward as you say France, the game is NOT going to end like this. Because this is SoS scoring, you are right, I do not need to solo to get a good point score.

However, I will not consider drawing until each of Germany and Italy have more centers than you, Austria or England. And keeping 5 countries in the draw does not allow my friends Germany and Italy to get the number of centers that they also need and deserve to have a realistic chance of getting enough points to help them advance to the next round.

As I said above, if you want a draw, then give up England and Bel to Germany, and let Italy get back into the game.
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: In fact I don't want a draw. If I vote draw right now you win.
Why England deserve the same destiny as Turkey? Why I have to surrender Belg to Germany when he has Holland. Germany deserves more SCs but not England HSCs, perhaps Sweden.
Also:Italy back, of course, give Greece to him.
Then, when you have only 6 or 7 SCs, the same as me, not more, not less, I will vote draw.
02 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: The truth comes out.
03 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: I'm frankly quite tired of this game. Russia has earned my ire (for reasons I still don't understand). Italy was a perfectly friendly face that I had to to stab to keep Russia on my side (whoops lol) and Germany/France/England/Turkey have sent a combined 5 messages to me. No offense intended to any of you, but only Russia & Italy have any credible claim to be "diplomats."

I'm eagerly looking forward to my exit (though I will fight to the bitter end, for honor!). I'm doing my utmost to feed Italy the remainder of my SCs/deny them to Russia (not out of a particular spite at this point, just out of the calculus that I owe Italy and do not owe Russia). However, Italy seems comfortable with Russia having the shot at the solo, so I'm sure it will be a nail biter for some of you.

Barring Russia & Italy, I genuinely hope to never have the pleasure of playing with this crew of players again. @Italy, lets be better friends next time (my b!) and @Russia, lets start a little further away!

Auf Wiedersehen!
03 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: You're still in it mate; don't give up the ship yet.
03 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Austria, you have played, and continue to play, honorably and have been a true diplomat the entire way, even as I attack you.

While I genuinely and personally feel bad for attacking you (because you have played so nobly), when I saw how fast you were eliminating Italy, I decided that I needed to help Italy get back in the game and be able to grow again. I also did not want to see Germany as your next target when E/F were already against Germany. Absent my turning on you, I felt that you and France would dominate and set the mid-game and/or end-game terms, instead of me, Germany and Italy having the bigger say.

Game-wise, I am happy with my decision to choose Germany and Italy over you, but I would of course consider you an outstanding alliance prospect if the circumstances are different in a future game.

I glad to hear that you will keep fighting your best, because that keeps the game interesting and also does respect to the tournament.
03 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: "The aim of the game is to Win. If you cannot win you have to do your best to stop leading player get the solo". Forum saying.
Keep fighting Austria!
04 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: All, I just posted my DRAW vote.

Why did I post my draw vote? Because I want to prove to everyone that France is a FRAUD. France is going around yelling solo warnings and the sky is falling, but then he/she openly said that he/she will NOT draw now, because he/she needs to "win" the most centers. Where will France get those supply centers? Likely from Germany or France.

Because this tournament is SoS scoring, I do NOT need to solo. I only need enough points to get through to the semi-finals. I have calculated everyone's current points if the game ended right now, and I would get 52.2% percent of the points (see chart below). That's as powerful as getting a 2way draw in a standard scoring game, and thus should be enough points to put me thru to the semi-finals. Because this is SoS scoring, and given my current position and sc count, I do not need to risk going for a solo or risk alienating my German or Italian allies.

Here is the point summary if you all draw right now:

sc sc^2 % of pts
-----------------------------------
France 6 36 15.5%
Italy 5 25 10.8%
Germany 5 25 10.8%
Austria 4 16 6.9%
England 3 9 3.9%
Russia 11 121 52.2%
Turkey 0 0 0.0%
-----------------------------------
Totals 34 232 100%

I wish my draw vote were not "hidden", and I wish everyone could see France's lack of a draw vote. Nevertheless, France will continue to show his/her true colors by continuing to take the offensive against Germany and/or looking to get more sc at the expense of his/her neighbors.

My number one loyalty to another player, for all to see in this game, is to Germany. Germany has been honest, generous, and loyal to me from the first move and that loyalty has never once waivered. I will NOT stab Germany (unless Germany makes a move on me first). I will also continue to work to get Germany MORE centers from others so that Germany can go from 10% of the points to 30% or more of the points.

My second loyalty is to Italy. While Italy lied and played mind games with me in the early moves, he/she has become a great and communicative ally after that, coordinating moves perfectly to get back in the game, earn builds, and weaken Austria. I will NOT take Con or Smy from Italy, and I will help Italy continue to get builds, unless Italy makes a move to hurt me or to turn loyalties and help Austria. As long as Italy continues to work with me, I will work to help Italy to double his/her current 10% of the points to over 20% of the total points!

Given the above picture, my proposed 3way draw end game, for all to see, is as follows:

sc sc^2 % of pts
-----------------------------------
France 0 0 0.0%
Italy 9 81 20.4%
Germany 11 121 30.4%
Austria 0 0 0.0%
England 0 0 0.0%
Russia 14 196 49.2%
Turkey 0 0 0.0%
-----------------------------------
Totals 34 398 100%

Under this proposal, I would still end up with 49.2% of the points, which is still almost exactly like a 2way draw in a standard game, and all the points I expect to need to advance to the semi-finals. Plus by helping Germany and Italy get more centers, they can build to keep me in check so that I do not go above 14 centers (a 4 center cushion and more than enough to protect against a late game solo).

It should be said that my third loyalty is to Austria. Even though I am working towards elimination, Austria has been an honorable and friendly diplomat the entire game, and if Italy makes one wrong move, I am very happy to have Austria take that third place in my proposed draw instead of Italy.

My fourth loyalty is to England. England and I do not talk now, but in the completely unexpected case that Germany would stab me, I would then happily support England to Germany's centers.

My fifth and last loyalty is to France. I think France is a fraud and I prefer that France get no points whatsoever. However, if Italy so chooses to share those proposed last 9 centers with France (after Germany has 11 and I have 14) to have a 4way draw, that only boosts the SoS scoring for me and for my friend Germany, so I would not oppose it.

I think my 3way proposal is a strong deal for Germany, who would end with over 30% of the points (very comparable to a standard 3way draw).

My proposal is also a decent result for Italy, whom almost certainly faces elimination if he/she changes loyalties away from me, as I can slide into Con and then Smy if Italy even flinches towards Ion sea. (It is true that Italy France and Austria could all stay together and keep Italy alive, but then my percent of the Sos points just go even higher than 50%, with more countries surviving the end game with lower sc counts -- an interesting quirk of the SoS scoring outcomes.)

Well I just stripped in front of the world. Let's see which way this goes.
04 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: As I said.
You don:t need the solo be sisè this is a SoS scoring. You are in fact wining right now.
Moreover everybody can check my moves since spring 1901 and can see I support hold my positions against Germany 99% on the other side German is who is attacking me 99%
So Russia don't tell lies, because everybody will see how mean you are.
04 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Kewl kids vote for the draw.
04 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Russia, if only you have said:
" people, help me eliminate my enemies (those last loyal to me) and I will grant you sharing the pot"...
But no. So proud, so greedy.
04 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: I apologize if I sounded mean or overly aggressive. I will tone it back.

I just want to be clear that we either draw now or I am actively playing for the elimination of England, Austria, and France, to the benefit of Germany, Italy and me.

It should also be more than obvious to all that France is not willing to draw now and instead will go for centers off of Germany, and sooner or later England and/or Italy as well, unless France is dealt with in short order.
04 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Just so we are all clear (and im sure we are) I am 100% on board with Russia and I too will not turn against him. Your talks of solo are lost on me as Russia has always been transparent and honest. Italy joining us will only straighten the end game results that im confident the three of us agree on.
04 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1907: Russia again wrong. I don't want Germany centers. I want that Germany, Austria, England and Italy want Russian centers.
06 Apr 19 UTC Spring, 1908: Moderator: (Durga): paused till the 8th
09 Apr 19 UTC Spring, 1908: Moderator: (Durga): Play on
12 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Thank you for leaving your island unprotected, England. There is zero chance you are getting any builds from Germany.
12 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: In fact there are chance. Few, but they are.
Sadly, a new opponent has joined our interesting and, until this moment equilibrated, battle.
13 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Genuinely sorry for Germany. E/F attack him the entire game and continue to attack him no matter how big I get. If I solo, which may or may not happen now, I will thank E/F a million times.

And props to Austria for fighting on for survival with no help from anyone.
13 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: You have a golden voice Russia. We never attacked Germany neither Italy... but, you convinced all of them you were the victim. Congratulations.
13 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: No matter how big you get they continue working from you.
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Ah ok, but the orders tab says differently: "The army at Belgium support move to Holland from Heligoland Bight. (fail)"
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: As everybody can see there are lots of English and French units in German territory.
Don't be so shy. You are worst than wormtongue.
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Well folks! Anyone feel like running the numbers to see if we could stop the solo?

Munich is vulnerable this next turn but so is Kiel. Vienna is untenable as is Trieste but we could hold the line at Venice. Russia doesn't have the southern fleets to push through if France and Italy can make amends.

In the north... we have the fleet power to stop the attack but we'd need immediate coordination between France and England and Italy to entirely pull back.
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Germany, you'd need to keep Ruhr, Kiel, and Tyrolia. Anything else dooms us. We'll just have to rely on everyone being in the same leaky boat, if we're to score any points at all!
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: obviously im am ob board with Austria
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: I have aided England all that I could. Now I can help all of you, or at least try. Don't tell more here but in private explain your ideas and which units are you going to destroy to create a defensive line.
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Thanks again for aiding England on that forward retreat to Hel and then the attack on Hol while you were "not" attacking Germany. Without that "help" I would have never been able to walk into Den AND Mun in one move. Keep up the good work France.
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: As always you say bla bla bla. It's a pitty other players trust you and believe your words. Was not me who convinced Germany to leave Denmark and Munich. I say "good work Russia" and you don't say "thanks" but say "it was your work, France". Well. Then I say " If the stupid leader wants to tank me it's OK". :)
14 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Russia has been lying to everyone. Frances words are correct
15 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: I lied to and stabbed Germany and Italy to try for a solo. I take responsibility for that.

But I'm not lying about the orders tab showing the E/F attack on Hol (everyone can check that for themselves). And I'm not lying that E/F continued attacks on Germany made it possible for me to stab Germany and walk into Mun and Den, because Germany had to defend against E/F (which everyone can see by the move orders as well).

I'm just saying that Germany was in a no-win situation, since E/F were not smart enough to stop attacking Germany when I was getting so big. Germany was forced to trust me because E/F continued to attack him.
15 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: If saying that makes you feel less guilty.
15 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: By the way, if my solo try fails, here is the current SoS scoring that all would have right now:

sc sc^2 % of points
-------------------------------------------
France 6 36 10.9%
Italy 4 16 4.8%
Germany 3 9 2.7%
Austria 3 9 2.7%
England 2 4 1.2%
Russia 16 256 77.6%
Turkey 0 0 0.0%
--------------------------------------
34 330 100.0%

France getting 11% and England and Germany only getting 1% and 2% does not seem like a great reward for stopping a solo.

Of course, I expect everyone to try to stop me, but at least get France to share a few more of his points with the reset of you to make things fair, since you are all equally necessary to stop the solo.
15 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Russia, if we all stop you will mean that the rest of players will have conquered some SCs that now you own. Thus ending all of us with 6or 7 SCs. And I will be happy.
15 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Russia stop your garbage talk. No one cares what you have to say anymore
15 Apr 19 UTC Autumn, 1908: Id gladly give France a solo if it meant eliminating you
23 Apr 19 UTC Spring, 1910: Darn!

Good game, everyone!
23 Apr 19 UTC Spring, 1910: We tried at least.
Well played Russia.
25 Apr 19 UTC Well played!

My only request is that no one pokes at Venice, obviously I can't defend it. But I'd love to get to be "on the board" if nothing else!
25 Apr 19 UTC That is reasonable. France do you agree to this?
26 Apr 19 UTC Gg all. Best of luck in your other ODC games.
26 Apr 19 UTC Gg chluke. The same to you.
26 Apr 19 UTC Good game chluke. That was some decent mesmerizing and playing on my heart strings to help you to victory.
26 Apr 19 UTC It was a nice game.
Thank you everyone for your time.
27 Apr 19 UTC Axtulkas, you're a brilliant tactician. Germany and I could not crack your moves.

Hamilton, you did well to win back your home centers and not be emilinated.

SpaceDip, you fought every inch of the way. I thought we would have eliminated you long ago, but we couldn't.

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Russia
chluke (7741 D (G))
Won. Bet: 5 D, won: 35 D
18 supply-centers, 17 units
France
axtulkas (70 D X)
Survived. Bet: 5 D
9 supply-centers, 7 units
Italy
Survived. Bet: 5 D
3 supply-centers, 3 units
England
SpaceDip (773 D)
Survived. Bet: 5 D
2 supply-centers, 2 units
Germany
Locke- (1285 D)
Survived. Bet: 5 D
2 supply-centers, 2 units
Austria
Aeschines (100 D)
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
Turkey
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
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