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Finished: 12 AM Thu 07 Mar 19 UTC
Private 2018 GBT Finals - Game 8
1 day, 12 hours /phase
Pot: 35 D - Autumn, 1915, Finished
Classic, No messaging, Anonymous players, Draw-Size Scoring, Hidden draw votes
1 excused missed turn
Game won by mhsmith0 (678 D)
03 Dec 18 UTC Spring, 1901: Moderator: (ghug): Congratulations on making it to the 2018 Gunboat Tournament Finals!

Finalists, you've been placed into five games. If you're not in five games, you haven't received each power exactly once, or you feel you've been put in the tournament in error, please contact me as soon as possible. There are three additional games in this round being played by non-finalists. These games are there to preserve anonymity as the tournament winds down, and their scores will not be included in tournament standings.

Games have been paused to ensure that nobody misses a phase due to the abnormal nature of the game starts. If you have not voted unpause by Wednesday, December 2nd, I will contact you and begin docking from your seven days of allocated pause time in one day increments. If you need a pause, please let me know. Since the finals have a smaller pool of players, any pause in this round will pause all games to preserve anonymity. Since the holidays are coming up, any pause time needed by multiple players in December will not be counted against your seven days.

Please contact me with any questions.

Good luck!
13 Dec 18 UTC Autumn, 1902: Moderator: (ghug): All games paused until the 17th by request.
18 Dec 18 UTC Autumn, 1902: Moderator: (ghug): Unpaused
24 Dec 18 UTC Autumn, 1903: Moderator: (ghug): All games paused until the 26th by request.
28 Dec 18 UTC Autumn, 1903: Moderator: (ghug): Unpaused
11 Jan 19 UTC Autumn, 1906: Moderator: (ghug): All games paused until the 14th by request.
15 Jan 19 UTC Autumn, 1906: Moderator: (ghug): Unpaused
19 Jan 19 UTC Spring, 1907: Moderator: (ghug): All games paused until the 21st by request.
22 Jan 19 UTC Spring, 1907: Moderator: (ghug): Unpaused
17 Feb 19 UTC Autumn, 1913: Moderator: (Claesar): All games paused until the 24th by request.
25 Feb 19 UTC Autumn, 1913: Moderator: (Claesar): Unpaused!
04 Mar 19 UTC Good game to everybody but darg.
04 Mar 19 UTC I'm very disappointed in you, Austria :-(
04 Mar 19 UTC Darg's a Mod. It's natural for them to play poorly post modship.
04 Mar 19 UTC Wait I'm supposed to be his mentor. So I suppose it's all my own fault.
04 Mar 19 UTC I did.... Poorly
04 Mar 19 UTC I believed Austria s hints foolishly. Apologies to all
04 Mar 19 UTC YAY :D
04 Mar 19 UTC off the cuff, I think Germany was best served in stabbing France back when he still had a slot in Venice and France was in Italy, and it was really hard for me to roll up to 18 quickly
Here I think Germany probably succumbed to thinking that his eastern front was secure (correct) and that therefore I couldn't get to 18 (incorrect)
My path to 18 was always just France throwing it to me out of anger at Germany (though interestingly, on the last turn I very very very nearly went TYS-WMED supported by GOL which would have been... uh... bad :P )
04 Mar 19 UTC fwiw I was quite sincere in being willing to settle for the 2wd with Germany, but at the same time I was going to at least take a SHOT at the solo, especially since "I tapped Marseilles to prevent France from being able to defend Burgundy" was a reasonably fair explanation
I do think Germany would have been better off holding out to see if I was willing to retreat further just to get him to kill France; I was definitely thinking of vacating Warsaw as a bribe/security deposit to Germany, and given the positions, once Germany started to stab, I'd almost certainly have at absolute worst a coin flip or 2 for the solo
04 Mar 19 UTC also @Claesar what did I do that was wrong? Or is it more "I really wanted to try and work together" (which if so I think was perfectly fine, I enjoyed working w/ you and would have been happy to continue, but part of why I stabbed you was that all of a sudden, France was pulling away from your front, and I figured that A/G against I/F was pretty possible, and given that I'd rather just go ahead and take advantage while I could)
04 Mar 19 UTC also apologies to Germany and Italy for the stabs (though my "stab" of Pie-Mar was I think a chance worth taking and really depended on whether France was willing to throw it to me). In press games I'm probably overly hesitant to make a stab but I think in gunboat games, a good stab at a good time is probably the best way to honor the "you should at least TRY for a solo when you can" mindset
04 Mar 19 UTC Yeah, Germany had chances to stab earlier when I couldn't give away a certain solo in one move.
04 Mar 19 UTC That's why I didn't make much effort to defend anything last the stalemate line.
04 Mar 19 UTC Oh right, I was in this game.
04 Mar 19 UTC Sort of.
04 Mar 19 UTC At any rate this was a fun and interesting game and I'm happy to gunboat w/ any you guys again in the future :)
04 Mar 19 UTC Well done mhsmith!
04 Mar 19 UTC ty :)
04 Mar 19 UTC I actually remember being *REALLY* annoyed that Germany was going whole hog towards not stabbing France back around 1910, when I was nowhere near able to stab anyone ftw, but at the same time it'd have been reasonably easy for us to "negotiate" our way towards the 2wd; he'd give back Venice (but I wouldn't grab it quickly), I didn't have the sea power to easily force MAO so we'd both have solo chances but it'd be challenging for either of us, etc
otoh I feel like I worked my ass off to force Italy and then protect my eastern border and just grind my way inch by inch by inch to a spot where I could try and get Germany to stab France for the 2wd with a chance for the solo hit
04 Mar 19 UTC tbh i kinda wonder what would have happened if FRANCE stabbed Germany, right around spring 1912 when Germany was going full bore towards pushing east
something like ENG-NTH, Bur-Bel, Lon-Yor, Bre-Pic, and I think it starts getting difficult for Germany. Probably Germany can throw me the solo there but I suspect it's a non-trivial exercise given how much of my *stuff* was focused on Italy and the seas.
04 Mar 19 UTC I thought about it. I'm pretty risk averse in gunboat in situations like that though.
04 Mar 19 UTC Yeah I vaguely recall being interested in waht would have happened there, but I def. hadn't expected to see it.
05 Mar 19 UTC I'd like to thank you all both for playing and for killing me quickly.

Congrats, Mr. Smith.
05 Mar 19 UTC thanks! :D
(will happily murder you in some other game in the future as well :P )
05 Mar 19 UTC At least I lasted marginally longer then ghug, I’d have never been able to show my face around the Cascadia country club.
05 Mar 19 UTC I lasted longer than both of you. Can I get my cascadia MVP points now?
05 Mar 19 UTC So.... to be open and honest... I was happy with a three way. Austria's stubborn (::grin::) refusal to vote 'draw' eventually wore me down. I HOPED I was reading his signals that he would hold off from two more SC's. I hoped in vain... Also, his repeated support of Bal to Liv confused me. I, bathing in insecurity, figured I was missing some secret plan thing that I had not experienced. Again... a vain hope. I enjoyed the game much. I should have stabbed ole France sooner... But it was still a blast.
05 Mar 19 UTC oh I'm happy to chat about my support of Bal to Liv. I wanted to explicitly abandon any threat to STP, so that you could feel comfortable moving Norway into a more offensive position. If that didn't work, I'd have probably just vacated Warsaw to see if that could make you bite. If THAT didn't work, I'd have considered vacating Moscow but probably just settle for the lame 3wd.
05 Mar 19 UTC I was also (I thought) pretty blatantly signaling through most of 1910-1915 that I wasn't interested in going after your home centers, so you could feel free to attack France. I was also kinda mulling over just letting you hang out in Venice for a while, but eventually I just needed you out of there to set up a perimeter, all the more so given that it seemed you were stubbornly refusing to stab, and at that point I didn't have much to lose from trying to adventure against France :P
05 Mar 19 UTC I think I read you signals... Or most of them. I was looking France at that point... And admit I was sentamental. I didn't play gunboat... And paid for it. There are no friends in gunboat
05 Mar 19 UTC Liking... Not looking... Stupid autocorrect
05 Mar 19 UTC I think you can make friends in gunboat, but I also think stabbing is pretty guilt-free since it's not like you're talking to ppl. Overall I'd have been perfectly fine if I ended up at 17 centers and 2wd, but there wasn't any real downside to me to take a shot at Marseilles on that turn, or MAO on a future turn, etc. I think you probably needed to insist on something like getting Warsaw in return for stabbing France, something like popping Pru-Liv, Sil-Pru etc, and then just holding mainly while signaling support to you retaking Warsaw, and if I vacated it then you're good to go, otherwise nah.
Of course, that would tip off France so it's risky in and of itself...
I think the best course of action was probably to go all in with the A/G alliance and stab France while I was still mucking about in Italy. It took me a WHILE to build up enough fleets and get them into attacking position, so you had pretty realistic odds of forcing a blockade in MAO if you made the right moves at the right time.
Spring 1910: Edi-Yor, Bel-Pic, Kiel-Ruhr, etc wouldn't have been bad. You also could have vacated Norway and basically treated it as something where if ever I went into Livonia, you'd immediately patch things up with France and shut down any 2wd potential, or something like that.
Once you convoyed out of England in fall 1910, as well as basically moving ALL of your forces east, I was basically like "I'll try to work w/ Germany, but at the same time I'm happy to enough to finagle a solo attempt if I can ever get away with it"
PS fwiw, I also spent a lot of time making sure that I never double occupied Liv/Mos, partially as a defensive measure (you could force Liv to retreat to Moscow, which was defensible w/ Sev so I'd never get screwed via overreach) and partially as a signal to you to do something I wanted to see with your F NOR.
05 Mar 19 UTC Aye.. thanks that makes sense.y move away from France was meant to indicate mty desire for a 3wd... Which was really not necessary. Congrats on a good game.
05 Mar 19 UTC ty i thought u played well too, was happy to work w/ you and would be happy to work w/ you again in the future (maybe even to an actual 2wd next time :P )
05 Mar 19 UTC I'd be glad to play with any of you as well...
05 Mar 19 UTC @mhsmith: You took my centres, that was wrong.. But I'd play with you again ;-)

Start Backward Open large map Forward End

Austria
mhsmith0 (678 D)
Won. Bet: 5 D, won: 35 D
18 supply-centers, 16 units
Germany
dargorygel (541 D (G))
Survived. Bet: 5 D
12 supply-centers, 10 units
France
peterwiggin (15136 D Mod (S))
Survived. Bet: 5 D
4 supply-centers, 8 units
England
VillageIdiot (6680 D)
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
Italy
Claesar (4478 D Mod)
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
Turkey
ghug (5046 D (B))
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
Russia
Ezio (1746 D)
Defeated. Bet: 5 D
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